The Eucharist is :Protestant Theology & Catholic Doctrines by patrick j miron / "vs" Correct Bible commentary

The Eucharist is :Protestant Theology & Catholic Doctrines by patrick j miron

Protestant Theology & Catholic Doctrines

Exposed to cover & discover the “Naked Truth“... Catholic responses to the Booklet: “Answers to my Catholic Friends” by Thomas F. Heinze   Part 2

A Catholic reply to Protestant “[mis]- Understandings” Part 2

“Do the Bread and Wine Become Christ Body and Blood”?

My dear friends in Christ,

Allow me to please set a platform for this part of the discussion. I do not exaggerate one iota when I claim

that this topic, while wrongly understood, is nevertheless a well thought out and formulated thesis. It is draconian in nature because it attempts to place a STAKE  into the very heart, body, mind and soul of the entirety of our Catholic beliefs. If one is unable to defend this issue,  of Christ “Real Presence, one is unable to defend Catholism in total. They win; we lose! …WHY?

1324 The Eucharist is "the source and summit of the Christian life." "The other sacraments, and indeed all ecclesiastical ministries and works of the apostolate, are bound up with the Eucharist and are oriented toward it. For in the blessed Eucharist is contained the whole spiritual good of the Church, namely Christ himself, our Pasch." [Sacrifice]

1074 "The liturgy is the summit toward which the activity of the Church is directed; it is also the font from which all her power flows." It is therefore the privileged place for catechizing the People of God. "Catechesis is intrinsically linked with the whole of liturgical and sacramental activity, for it is in the sacraments, especially in the Eucharist, that Christ Jesus works in fullness for the transformation of men."

Catholics Reply:

I shall include my comments directly under his, comments, in order to make it an easy reference to each specific point that Thomas has raised. This is indeed a well thought out position.




 BUT is proves clearly and without discussion that it is based ONLY on only human logic. No credit is given to Jesus as  a all- Good-God; able to do ANY GOOD THING.


 If in FACT, the Catholic position is correct; then this becomes the GREATEST POSSIBLE GOOD in the entire history of the Universe.

I’m finding it beneficial to keep reminding myself that Thomas too, like us is a Baptized Christian. A Brother in Christ, and that this is not a direct assault on us personally. It is evident the he loves, and in his own way is serving God.


Patrick j miron religious opinion :


It is also evident that my understanding of God limiting Protestant understanding is too correct.








While the arguments are well thought out, and a bit different than the normal Protestant explanation; based on John 6: selected verses; 35-69,  there clearly is lacking the depth of understanding of God’s very Nature and the precise reason for human existence and how they necessarily relate as expressed within the Bible itself. God’s basis for imposing such a penalty is::

Matt. 25: 27-29 …“So take the talent from him, and give it to him who has the ten talents. … For to every one who has will more be given, and he will have abundance; but from him who has not, even what he has will be taken away” All those who are “given more “ [Baptized], will be held to a far more critical evaluation by God., as the Holy Spirit is AVAILABLE to them for guidance.

 

 

Ed. note ,

1 cor 11: Verse 16

[16] But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.

We have no such custom here, nor any of the other churches of God - The several churches that were in the apostles' time had different customs in things that were not essential; and that under one and the same apostle, as circumstances, in different places, made it convenient. And in all things merely indifferent the custom of each place was of sufficient weight to determine prudent and peaceable men.

Yet even this cannot overrule a scrupulous conscience, which really doubts whether the thing be indifferent or no. But those who are referred to here by the apostle were contentious, not conscientious, persons.

Verse 18

[18] For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it.

In the church — In the public assembly.

I hear there are schisms among you; and I partly believe it —

That is, I believe it of some of you. It is plain that by schisms is not meant any separation from the church, but uncharitable divisions in it; for the Corinthians continued to be one church; and, notwithstanding all their strife and contention, there was no separation of any one party from the rest, with regard to external communion. And it is in the same sense that the word is used,

1 Corinthians 1:10; 1 Corinthians 12:25; which are the only places in the New Testament, beside this, where church schisms are mentioned.

Therefore, the indulging any temper contrary to this tender care of each other is the true scriptural schism.

This is, therefore, a quite different thing from that orderly separation from corrupt churches which later ages have stigmatized as schisms; and have made a pretence for the vilest cruelties, oppressions, and murders, that have troubled the Christian world.

Both heresies and schisms are here mentioned in very near the same sense; unless by schisms be meant, rather, those inward animosities which occasion heresies; that is, outward divisions or parties:

 so that whilst one said, "I am of Paul," another, "I am of Apollos," this implied both schism and heresy. So wonderfully have later ages distorted the words heresy and schism from their scriptural meaning.

 Heresy is not, in all the Bible, taken for "an error in fundamentals," or in anything else; nor schism, for any separation made from the outward communion of others.

 Therefore, both heresy and schism, in the modern sense of the words, are sins that the scripture knows nothing of; but were invented merely to deprive mankind of the benefit of private judgment, and liberty of conscience.

Verse 19

[19] For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.

There must be heresies — Divisions.

Among you — In the ordinary course of things; and God permits them, that it may appear who among you are, and who are not, upright of heart.

Verse 20

[20] When ye come together therefore into one place, this is not to eat the Lord's supper.

Therefore — That is, in consequence of those schisms.

It is not eating the Lord's supper — That solemn memorial of his death; but quite another thing.

Verse 21

[21] For in eating every one taketh before other his own supper: and one is hungry, and another is drunken.

For in eating what ye call the Lord's supper, instead of all partaking of one bread, each person brings his own supper, and eats it without staying for the rest. And hereby the poor, who cannot provide for themselves, have nothing; while the rich eat and drink to the full just as the heathens use to do at the feasts on their sacrifices.

Verse 22

[22] What? have ye not houses to eat and to drink in? or despise ye the church of God, and shame them that have not What shall I say to you? shall I praise you in this? I praise you not.

Have ye not houses to eat and drink your common meals in? or do ye despise the church of God - Of which the poor are both the larger and the better part. Do ye act thus in designed contempt of them?

Verse 23

[23] For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread:

I received — By an immediate revelation.

Verse 24

[24] And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.

This is my body, which is broken for you —

 That is, this broken bread is the sign of my body, which is even now to be pierced and wounded for your iniquities.

Take then, and eat of, this bread, in an humble, thankful, obediential remembrance of my dying love; of the extremity of my sufferings on your behalf, of the blessings I have thereby procured for you, and of the obligations to love and duty which I have by all this laid upon you.

Verse 25

[25] After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me.

After supper — Therefore ye ought not to confound this with a common meal.

Do this in remembrance of me — The ancient sacrifices were in remembrance of sin: this sacrifice, once offered, is still represented in remembrance of the remission of sins.

Verse 26

[26] For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord's death till he come.

Ye show forth the Lord's death — Ye proclaim, as it were, and openly avow it to God, and to all the world.

Till he come — In glory.

Verse 27

[27] Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.

Whosoever shall eat this bread unworthily —

That is, in an unworthy, irreverent manner; without regarding either Him that appointed it, or the design of its appointment. Shall be guilty of profaning that which represents the body and blood of the Lord.

Verse 28

[28] But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup.

But let a man examine himself —

Whether he know the nature and the design of the institution, and whether it be his own desire and purpose throughly to comply therewith.

Verse 29

[29] For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.

For he that eateth and drinketh so unworthily as those Corinthians did, eateth and drinketh judgment to himself - Temporal judgments of various kinds, 1 Corinthians 11:30.

 Not distinguishing the sacred tokens of the Lord's body - From his common food.

Verse 30

[30] For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.

For this cause — Which they had not observed.

Many sleep — In death.

Verse 31

[31] For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.

If we would judge ourselves — As to our knowledge, and the design with which we approach the Lord's table.

We should not be thus judged — That is, punished by God.

Verse 32

[32] But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.

When we are thus judged, it is with this merciful design, that we may not be finally condemned with the world.

Verse 33

[33] Wherefore, my brethren, when ye come together to eat, tarry one for another.