How the Roman Catholic Church started "Vs" patrick j miron

you have to start


 some where

The Cathars, Simon de Montfort and the Albigensian Crusade

The Albigensian crusade arrived at Beziers early in 1209. the city refused to hand over the heretics, and soon after, the city fell and more than 20,000 people were killed. It was for this battle that the infamous words 'Kill them all - God will recognise his own' were spoken by Pope Arnaud Amaury. Following this, the other fortified cities did not put up a battle.
Carcassonne, not especially fortified at that stage, put up a fierce battle but were eventually defeated after their water supply was cut off. The city was placed, most unfortunately, into the hands of Simon de Montfort, who spent many years battling against the Cathars of the region.
The crusaders returned home, but the Cathars continued. they prepared many fortified towns and fortresses that they considered impregnable. It was against these that Simon de Montfort and his army fought bitterly for the next nine years. There are many terrible stories of the burnings, slit throats and slaughters that followed the fall of each of these fortified towns.
It was at Castelnaudry that Simon de Montfort first faced a united army assembled by the Counts of Toulouse and Foix. Both sides claimed victory in the battle that followed. But by now both the King and the Pope were becoming increasingly concerned about Simon de Montfort and his activities in the south, fearing that he would take personal control of the region. The army of the Count of Toulouse was thus reinforced by the King's army, in preparation for the next battle - the Battle of Muret. However, despite outnumbering Simon de Montfort's army by ten to one, they lost the battle. Soon after Toulouse itself surrendered and the count of Toulouse Raymond VI fled to England. The south was completely in the hands of Simon de Montfort.
In 1216 Pope Innocent III died, and Raymond VII of Toulouse returned, with his father Raymond VI, to his city. The inhabitants had evicted the invaders, and simon de Montfort set a long siege against the city. This continued until June 1218, when a stone from a catapult killed de Montfort. Although his son tried to continue the battles over the following years, Armaury de Montfort was not as accomplished as his father, and by 1222 he abandoned his region to the French king and crown. Shortly after, the Counts of Toulouse and Foix and the King of France all died.

The royal crusade against the cathars in France

The Royal Crusade

On the 15th of January 1224 Armaury de Montfort left the reion and some semblance of normality returned. The lords re-entered their castles, and the Cathars slept more easily. But the new King of France, Louis VIII, saw an opportunity to recapture the lands in the south, and with the support of the new Pope, Honorius III, a new crusade started in May 1226.

The crusade was a partial success, defeating all the towns except Toulouse, until the new King became ill and died. However Toulouse was forced into a treaty - the Treaty of Meaux - that provided for the marriage of his daughter to Louis IX son, so that all his lands would pass to the French throne when he died.
It was following the Treaty of Meaux that the inquisition procedures were set-up, that were to play such a large role in the shaping of the region in the years to come. The Inquisition, acting initially for the Pope, had complete authority to crush heretics and the Cathars.
Taking refuge in the fortified castles, such as those at Queribus and Peyrepertuse, the Cathars were increasingly suffering and oppressed. Despite an attempt in 1240 by the conquered lords to retake their provinces, the battle was largely lost by this stage, and eventually Peyrepertuse castle was taken by the invaders.
The burning of heretics, in the hands of the Inquisition,  continued with a fury, despite an attempt by the knights from Montségur to defeat them. The massacre of inquisition agents by the knights from Montségur only made matters worse, if that was possible, and the revenge of the King and the church was brutal.
The 'impregnable' fortress at Montségur was eventually defeated and hundreds of people thrown to their deaths in an enormous fire near the fortress. This defeat also marked the end of the hopes of the Cathar religion in the region. Queribus and Puilarens castles were defeated in the following years, the Count of Toulouse died without a male heir, and soon the whole of Languedoc became part of France and the French crown.
Footnote: the last known Cathar was Guillaume Bélibaste, who was burned alive in 1321, finally putting an end to more than a century of battles and burnings in the region.

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patrick j miron----- Catholic Questions Trent an In Dept study oart 3 -- Delusional commentary

Trent an In Dept study oart 3

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Re: Catholic Questions Trent an In Dept study oart 3

we can sin but the Church can't the Spiritrual Churnch ( the body of Christ can't sin ) but the catholic or any others church will fall in sin,

 

 Paul conmended us to Cut off those that commit sins or remain life style in sinful as Catholic Priests who molesters childrens, 

 

Jesus also Said: if your hand do sin cut it off, if your eye sin pull it out so that way you can go heaven rather have two hand go hell, yes we all sinners but before God accepted us we must be clean by the blood of Jesus, so that we can be Body of Christ santifice and Holy, sin just like cancer in our body, when we have it we must cutt it off from our body or it will destroy us! the Body of Christ the Church can't be sin??

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Hi,

 

Thanks for the response.

 

We; all Catholics, ARE the "body of Christ" and yes we can and do sin as sinning is the "natural condition" of all humanity. 

 

 

The "unnatural condition then is to, with God's grace AVOID sin. Possible only with God’s help and our determination. Even with grace; “natural men” often fall into some level of sin.

 

 

1John.1 Verses 8 to 10

 

 

"If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just, and will forgive our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us."

 

 

1John.5 Verses 16 to 17

"If any one sees his brother committing what is not a mortal sin, he will ask, and God will give him life for those whose sin is not mortal. There is sin which is mortal; I do not say that one is to pray for that. All wrongdoing is sin, but there is sin which is not mortal.

 

 

John.20 Verses 20 to 23

" When he had said this, he showed them his hands and his side. Then the disciples were glad when they saw the Lord. 

 

Jesus said to them again, "Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, even so I send you." And when he had said this, he breathed on them,

 

 and said to them, "Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained"

 

I don’t recall where Paul advises us to “cut [ourselves from] off” sinners.

 

 To not associate with them unnecessarily- socially perhaps? But Christ Himself tells us:

 

Matt.9:12- 13 “But when he heard it, he said, "Those who are well have no need [without sin] of a physician, but those who are sick [sinners]” “Go and learn what this means, `I desire mercy, and not sacrifice.' For I came not to call the righteous, but sinners."

 

Mark.2: 17 “And when Jesus heard it, he said to them, "Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick; I came not to call the righteous, but sinners."

Certainly these priest are EVIL-sinners. But are they any worse than ones who has a abortion; or denies God; or does not give to God his Just Worship? NOT in God’s eye.

 

Matt.7: 1 "Judge not, that you be not judged” and this: John.7: 24 “Do not judge by appearances, but judge with right judgment."

 

The passages you quote from Paul to “cut off this or that” ARE NOT LITERAL. What they teach is our GRAVE-moral obligation to AVOID “the near occasion and temptation to sin.” THAT my friend is the lesson being taught here.

 

How anyone is “cleaned by the Blood of Christ” is these day’s seemingly a matter of personal choice.

 

 

 BUT my friend as the passages I shared above from 

 

 

First John, and John 20: that is NOT God’s way; and THERFORE the ONLY way it actually is going to happen.

 

 Jesus Instituted the Catholic Sacrament of Confession for this very reason; and it remains the ONLY acceptable manner [other than initial Baptism, which removes all PRIOR sins.]

 

I DID say “the Church” meaning the Catholic Church CANNOT sin as an absolute impossibility.

 

 

 I did NOT say “the body of Christ” cannot nor does not sin.

 

God Bless you,

 

pat

From: LEIN TRINH <lientcnguyen@...>
To: catholicquestions@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2012 1:36 PM
Subject: Re: Catholic Questions Trent an In Dept study part 3
 

 

we can sin but the Church can't the Spiritrual Churnch ( thebody of Christ can't sin )

 

 but the catholic or any others church will fall in sin,

 

 Paul conmended us to Cut off those that commit sins or remain life style in sinful

 

 as Catholic Priests who molesters childrens

 

 

, Jesus also Said

: if your hand do sin cut it off, if your eye sin pull it out so that way you can go heaven rather  have two hand go hell

 

, yes we all sinners but before God accepted us we must be clean by the blood of Jesus, 

 

so that we can be Body of Christ santifice and Holy, sin just like cancer in our body, 

 

when we have it we must cutt it off from our body or it will destroy us! the Body of Christ the Church can't be sin??

From: Patrick Miron <patrickmiron66@...>
 

 

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Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2012 7:13 AM
 

 

Subject: Catholic Questions Trent an In Dept study oart 3 [1 Attachment]

 

God Bless,

Pat

Patrick j miron --“WHERE Do the Differences Between Catholics and Come From?”

Protestant Theology & Catholic Doctrines

Exposed to cover & discover the “Naked Truth“... Catholic responses to the Booklet: “Answers to my Catholic Friends” by Thomas F. Heinze    part 3

According to the Church of Rome, all Protestants are heretics and anathema. Rome claims it alone is the true church and that there is no salvation outside it. This is sometimes denied by Roman Catholics, but is abundantly documented by the statements and decrees of Popes and Church Councils.

A Catholic reply to Protestant “[mis]- Understandings” Part 3

“WHERE Do the Differences Between Catholics and Come From?”

“Many people tell me [quoting Thomas], “you Protestants interpret the Bible one way, and the Catholic Church another.” …”The differences are not really differences of interpretation,  but of authority. For Biblical Protestants,  the authority is the Word of God.

 A priest summed it up this way: ”You Protestants believe everything that the book say’s’ “

2.   Second; on the issue of “authority.” 

Thomas [and most Protestants] 

are not recognizing what the Bible ACTUALLY say’s about the Catholic Church teachings Authoritatively, because it alone is Christ Own Church, and the One set of faith-beliefs taught and protected by God himself.

 The issue is further solidified by the fact that (#872)

{  Delusion belief of Patrick J Miron  #8790}

the Bible remains a Catholic Book, in collection, and in origin of the entire New Testament which explains then why God ONLY guides the CC in granting His “FULL TRUTH“, and CORRECT UNDERSTANDING of His Word.

It is extremely important; even vital to recognize that the Protestant claim that the bible; for them, “acts for “as their “god,” This is based on a complete and total falsehood. 

Because God” is not with them in the same manner He IS with us Catholics. The Bible Alone” then acts as the “only and final authority“, leading Protestants to consistent errors and numerous disagreements within even there own non-catholic ranks.”  

YET that same “final authority” is NOT fully accepted, and is often rejected, with amazing consistently, as “common self- selectively” is regularly applied on all of their following positions which are taught in the Bible.

2. The Primacy of Peter. Jesus gave the key’s to heavens access to Peter and the CC alone.

3. The denial of the proper place and absolute need for the CC as The Primary and Guided Teacher chosen by God

4. The essential Role of grace , especially “sacramental grace“ in BOTH Faith and salvation

7. The Seven Sacraments ALL instituted by Christ [explicitly or implicitly] for our benefit.

 Patrick j Miron Delusional belief #4567

4. Trent upheld the validity of the seven sacraments (baptism, communion, confirmation of church membership, penance and reconciliation (and receiving absolution from a priest), anointing of the sick--extreme unction, holy orders, and marriage). Protestants believe that the Bible only names two sacraments: baptism and communion.

8. Forgiveness of Sins and how it  MUST happen, because God Himself say’s so.

9. That reading the Bible while a good thing; OFTEN [as evidenced by the MULTITUDE of Protestant denominations and varying faith-beliefs] ; is dangerous when not done in full-accord with the One Authority guided and honored by God; thee CC. [Mt.16:15-19; Mt.28:16-20; John 14:16-17; John 17:15-19, John 20:19-22; Eph. 4:1-7, Acts 20:29, Rom. 3:2; Jer. 3:15; 1 John 4:4-5;  2^nd. Cor. 11:12-13, All of John chapter six; Mt. 7:21-23, 2^nd. Tim. 4:1-4, 2^nd. Tim.3:16-17, and 2^nd. Peter 2:1-2.] AND THIS IS only A PARTIAL LIST OF BIBLE PASSAGES THEY DO NOT ACCEPT., so it seems foolish to spend more time on this topic.

Our Catholic Catechism # 1849 defines “sin” as follows: “Sin is an offense against reason, truth, and right conscience; it is failure in genuine love for God and neighbor caused by a perverse attachment to certain goods. [PRIDE]  It wounds the nature of man and injures human solidarity. It has been defined as "an utterance, a deed, or a desire contrary to the eternal law."

There are some things in them hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other scriptures. You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, beware lest you be carried away with the error of lawless men and lose your own stability

John 5: 37 “And the Father who sent me has himself borne witness to me. His voice you have never heard, his form you have never seen;  and you do not have his word abiding in you, for you do not believe him whom he has sent.

 You search the scriptures, because you think that in them you have eternal life; 

 and it is they that bear witness to me;  yet you refuse to come to me that you may have life [Speaking of accepting the entire WORD of GOD]. I do not receive glory from men

 But I know that you have not the love of God within you.  I have come in my Father's name, and you do not receive me” [Listen to or Obey Me!]

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Watch out for patrick j miron--

Matthew 7:22
²¹"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.

 ²²Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?'

²³Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'
 

Apparently there are also people who would have the ability to drive demons out in Jesus' name and yet Jesus would not accept them because they were not true believers.
 

So was Jesus' criteria for a true believer in Mark 16 wrong?


RESPONSE:
Zawadi’s logic goes something like this:

1. True believers will perform signs.
2. This means that false believers will not be able to.
3. The individuals in Matthew 7:21-23 performed miracles.
4. Therefore they must have been genuine believers.
5. Yet Jesus rebuked them for being false believers.
6. Therefore we have a contradiction.

Let us repeat what Mark 16:17 says in context to see why the problem lies not with the texts, but with Zawadi’s erroneous logic:
"And he said to them, ‘Go into all the world and preach the gospel to the whole creation. He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned. And these signs will accompany those who believe: in my name they will cast out demons; they will speak in new tongues; they will pick up serpents, and if they drink any deadly thing, it will not hurt them; they will lay their hands on the sick, and they will recover.’ So then the Lord Jesus, after he had spoken to them, was taken up into heaven, and sat down at the right hand of God. And they went forth and preached everywhere, while the Lord worked with them and confirmed the message by the signs that attended it. Amen." Mark 16:15-20



Now that we have looked at the context the following questions need to be asked:
Did Jesus say that only true believers would perform signs? No.
Did Jesus say that false believers would not be able to perform signs? No.
Did Jesus even say that unbelievers who follow different religions would not be able to do miracles? No, not at all. In fact, this is what he did say about unbelievers and false prophets:
"And then if any one says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘Look, there he is!’ do not believe it. False Christs and false prophets will arise and show signs and wonders, to lead astray, if possible, the elect. But take heed; I have told you all things beforehand." Mark 13:21-23 

Strongholds 3--and Patrick J Miron religious deception and false belief

Patrick j Miron is convinced he has a special blessing on deception and being deceived .. because he can ..

 Romans 12-1-12- don't think of yourself 2 highly...RCC training and education can be miss-leading

A SUMMARY OF THE DECLARATIONS OF THE COUNCIL OF TRENT "Vs" Patrick j miron understanding the wrong truth

  A SUMMARY OF THE

DECLARATIONS OF THE COUNCIL OF TRENT

Has the Roman Catholic Church changed its basic doctrinal position in this present ecumenical era? The answer is no, it has not. The Council of Trent was a Catholic council held from 1545-1563 in an attempt to destroy the progress of the Protestant Reformation. This council denied every Reformation doctrine, including Scripture alone and grace alone. 




Trent hurled 125 anathemas (eternal damnations) against Bible-believing Christians.




 These proclamations and anathemas were fleshed out in the murderous persecutions vented upon Bible-believing Christians by Rome, and the solemn fact is that the Council of Trent has never been annulled. The Vatican II Council of the mid-1960s referred to Trent dozens of times, 


quoted Trent’s proclamations as authority, and reaffirmed Trent on every hand. The New Catholic Catechism cites Trent no less than 99 times. 




There is not the slightest hint that the proclamations of the Council of Trent have been abrogated by Rome.




 At the opening of the Second Vatican Council, Pope John XXIII stated, “I do accept entirely all that has been decided and declared at the Council of Trent.” Every cardinal, bishop and priest who participated in the Vatican II Council signed a document affirming Trent.  

Click here to view the main anathemas

Fourth session: decree concerning the canonical scriptures:

“If anyone does not accept as sacred and canonical the aforesaid books in their entirety and with all their parts [the 66 books of the Bible plus 12 apocryphal books, being two of Paralipomenon, two of Esdras, Tobias, Judith, Wisdom, Ecclesiasticus, Baruch, Sophonias, two of Macabees], as they have been accustomed to be read in the Catholic Church and as they are contained in the old Latin Vulgate Edition, and knowingly and deliberately rejects the aforesaid traditions, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA.”

Sixth session, canons concerning justification:

·          “If anyone says that justifying faith is nothing else than confidence in divine mercy, which remits sins for Christ’s sake, or that it is this confidence alone that justifies us, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons Concerning Justification, Canon 12).

·          “If anyone says that the justice received is not preserved and also not increased before God through good works, but that those works are merely the fruits and signs of justification obtained, but not the cause of its increase, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons Concerning Justification, Canon 24).

·          “If anyone says that the Catholic doctrine of justification as set forth by the holy council in the present decree, derogates  in some respect from the glory of God or the merits of our Lord Jesus Christ, and does not rather illustrate the truth of our faith and no less the glory of God and of Christ Jesus, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons Concerning Justification, Canon 33).

Seventh session, canons on baptism:

·          “If anyone says that in the Roman Church, which is the mother and mistress of all churches, there is not the true doctrine concerning the sacrament of baptism, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons on Baptism, Canon 3).

·          “If anyone says that baptism is optional, that is, not necessary for salvation, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons on Baptism, Canon 5).

·          “If anyone says that children, because they have not the act of believing, are not after having received baptism to be numbered among the faithful, and that for this reason are to be rebaptized when they have reached the years of discretion; or that it is better that the baptism of such be omitted than that, while not believing by their own act, they should be baptized in the faith of the Church alone, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons on Baptism, Canon 13).

Seventh session, canons on confirmation:

“If anyone says that the confirmation of those baptized is an empty ceremony and not a true and proper sacrament; or that of old it was nothing more than a sort of instruction, whereby those approaching adolescence gave an account of their faith to the Church, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons on Confirmation, Canon 1).

Thirteenth session, canons on the most holy sacrament of the Eucharist:

·          “If anyone denies that in the sacrament of the most Holy Eucharist are contained truly, really and substantially the body and blood together with the soul and divinity of our Lord Jesus Christ, and consequently the whole Christ, but says that He is in it only as in a sign, or figure or force, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons on the Most Holy Sacrament of the Eucharist, Canon 1).

·          “If anyone says that Christ received in the Eucharist is received spiritually only and not also sacramentally and really, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons on the Most Holy Sacrament of the Eucharist, Canon 8).

Fourteenth session, canons concerning the most holy sacrament of penance:

·          “If anyone says that in the Catholic Church penance is not truly and properly a sacrament instituted by Christ the Lord for reconciling the faithful of God as often as they fall into sin after baptism, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons Concerning the Most Holy Sacrament of Penance, Canon 1).

·          “If anyone denies that sacramental confession was instituted by divine law or is necessary to salvation; or says that the manner of confessing secretly to a priest alone, which the Catholic Church has always observed from the beginning and still observes, is at variance with the institution and command of Christ and is a human contrivance, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons Concerning the Most Holy Sacrament of Penance, Canon 7).

·          “If anyone says that the confession of all sins as it is observed in the Church is impossible and is a human tradition to be abolished by pious people; or that each and all of the faithful of Christ or either sex are not bound thereto once a year in accordance with the constitution of the great Lateran Council, and that for this reason the faithful of Christ are to be persuaded not to confess during Lent, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons Concerning the Most Holy Sacrament of Penance, Canon 8).

·          “If anyone says that God always pardons the whole penalty together with the guilt and that the satisfaction of penitents is nothing else than the faith by which they perceive that Christ has satisfied for them, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons Concerning the Most Holy Sacrament of Penance, Canon 8).

Twenty-second session, canons on the sacrifice of the mass:

·          “If anyone says that in the mass a true and real sacrifice is not offered to God; or that to be offered is nothing else than that Christ is given to us to eat, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons on the Sacrifice of the Mass, Canon 1).

·          “If anyone says that by those words, Do this for a commemoration of me, Christ did not institute the Apostles priests; or did not ordain that they and other priests should offer His own body and blood, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons on the Sacrifice of the Mass, Canon 2).

·          “If anyone says that the sacrifice of the mass is one only of praise and thanksgiving; or that it is a mere commemoration of the sacrifice consummated on the cross but not a propitiatory one; or that it profits him only who receives, and ought not to be offered for the living and the dead, for sins, punishments, satisfactions, and other necessities, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons on the Sacrifice of the Mass, Canon 3).

·          “If anyone says that it is a deception to celebrate masses in honor of the saints and in order to obtain their intercession with God, as the Church intends, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons on the Sacrifice of the Mass, Canon 5).

Twenty-third session, canons on the sacrament of order:

“If anyone says that there is not in the New Testament a visible and external priesthood, or that there is no power of consecrating and offering the true body and blood of the Lord and of forgiving and retaining sins, but only the office and bare ministry of preaching the Gospel; or that those who do not preach are not priests at all, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons on the Sacrifice of the Mass, Canon 1).

Twenty-third session, canons on the sacrament of order:

“If anyone says that the bishops who are chosen by the authority of the Roman pontiff are not true and legitimate bishops, but merely human deception, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA” (Canons on the Sacrifice of the Mass, Canon 8).

Twenty-fifth session, decree on purgatory:

“Since the Catholic Church, instructed by the Holy Ghost, has, following the sacred writings and the ancient tradition of the Fathers, taught in sacred councils and very recently in this ecumenical council that there is a purgatory, and that the souls there detained are aided by the suffrages of the faithful and chiefly by the acceptable sacrifice of the altar, the holy council commands the bishops that they strive diligently to the end that the sound doctrine of purgatory, transmitted by the Fathers and sacred councils, be believed and maintained by the faithful of Christ, and be everywhere taught and preached.”

Twenty-fifth session, on the invocation, veneration, and relics of saints, and sacred images:

“The holy council commands all bishops and others who hold the office of teaching and have charge of the cura animarum, that in accordance with the usage of the Catholic and Apostolic Church, received from the primitive times of the Christian religion, and with the unanimous teaching of the holy Fathers and the decrees of sacred councils, they above all instruct the faithful diligently in matters relating to intercession and invocation of the saints, the veneration of relics, and the legitimate use of images, teaching them that the saints who reign together with Christ offer up their prayers to God for men, that it is good and beneficial suppliantly to invoke them and to have recourse to their prayers, assistance and support in order to obtain favors from God through His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord, who alone is our redeemer and savior; and that they think impiously who deny that the saints who enjoy eternal happiness in heaven are to be invoked, or who assert that they do not pray for men, or that our invocation of them to pray for each of us individually is idolatry, or that it is opposed to the word of God and inconsistent with the honor of the one mediator of God and men, Jesus Christ, or that it is foolish to pray vocally or mentally to those who reign in heaven.”

By David Cloud